Posts by Sampisa

    T&C Part 3 all interesting especially:


    3.2.5

    It is not permissible to use the ‪Gameforge‬ Services via anonymisation services or similar means capable of suppressing or concealing the real IP address or the origin of the user.

    Whenever you use your cell phone, your real IP is hidden. Whenever you user Opera Mini, or decide to activate the optimisation of contents on Chrome, you come from a proxied IP. If you are a customer of some landline operators, you are inside a local network and your IP is the one of some big network routers. There are players coming from some countries (e.g. North Korea, China, Iran, Syria, Bahrain, Pakistan, Turkey, etc) who have to use VPNs to access to the internet. That's why the rule forbidding proxy usage was removed years ago from Ikariam, and we normally are really lenient about this matter. Our CoMa badidol decided that VPN or proxy usage is not forbidden per se, but its misuse (e.g. to hide actions circumventing IP-Sharing limits) can cause a ban.

    Please, let me do a little introduction.


    "Logical fallacies" are techniques used mainly by political speakers to convince the audience about their reasoning, but using a fake logic or creating relationship between unrelated events, or claiming that something is true because "everybody knows it". This is particular annoying on forums, because it easily starts flames based on nothing. That's why The crow I have to tell it another time: if you don't provide any proof your accusations, and you don't stop to create false correlations, I'll have to ask to a Mod to intervene. The same Deliverance : any further accusation or insults based on ethnicity or nationality won't be tolerated any more.


    So I avoid to answer about the Iranians attitude to commerce accounts (it's an Ad Hominem reasoning), how it is possible to grow in score in few minutes (you all know very well how) or to explain why it is wrong that "The solution is simple" (what is?) and similar amenities: please remember that correlation does not mean causation, so any further discussion is totally useless. There is an extensive literature about the fallacies, but maybe you can have a look at this video for a quick recap before to post anything else: https://youtu.be/IawIjqOJBU8 - In case, I'm sure that now we all are aware what I'm talking about.


    Moreover, please don't forget it, we are here to discuss about the game and not about the personal attitude of players in RL. If the tone and the level of this thread don't return at acceptable level, I'll ask to close it.


    Indeed, let me resume once more the situation. As you already know, on beta there are strong players using borderline techniques to grow and to improve their strength. A 12-years old server is not made by children but by really skilled players and big accounts, and be sure that, when we notice behaviour that can be considered against the rules, we will stop them, no matter if they are 12-years old. Moreover, as you noticed, we are intensifying checks on beta.


    The origin of the accounts and outgame agreements are NOT under our control and are NOT part of the reasons leading to a ban. Ethnicity or origin or alliance of a player are NOT reasons that make the accounts potentially guilty or that raise special need to keep them under special control. Usage of VPN / VPS is NOT forbidden in general, but in particular in countries where there is a regime that blocks connections on some parts of the world. Usage of banks is NOT forbidden, if we don't notice any rule violation like multiaccount. This is the game, such features/rules are present, you are free to use them too until you stay inside the rules.


    And about us: everybody is innocent until we gather enough proof that he is guilty, and such proofs must be strong, because we don't ban just on few "clues" or "hints" or "possibilities" or "words of mouth" or personal feelings. The players have to live with that., for better or worse. Just to let you know, if we were to apply just "clues" or "hints" or our personal feeling on the accounts of the players writing here, at least 3 of them should be permabanned. They are still playing because we DO apply that principle and we DO NOT stop anyone until OUR rules tell that we can do it. Even if you won't made aware about such rules, be sure that we apply them in a unbiased and fair way.


    This is the way things are, and will be.


    Kind regards

    Hi all,


    here is the update I promised about your proposal.


    First of all, I discussed a little with the whole Game Staff about your proposal, they all liked the idea and I think that their 5 cents were valuable too. So please let me steal a minute to show further possible refinements.


    It was proposed to extend the piracy misuse as in some other GF games: "If town level matched fortress level they will grow it fast enough because they need level 17 only. I would add other buildings as condition, for example tavern and warehouses, some buildings that everyone needs in normal play." Interesting point, IMHO. Someone else instead told that - I resume it - a player should enter on vacation mode as he wishes. It should be instead limited the opportunity to trade for some time after exiting from vmode. In this case, the point of view was moved to the actions available, not to the vmode itself. Both interesting points, probably they need further refinement.


    Anyway, I'm sure that you discussed enough abut this matter, so our one was just a reasoning... pour parler. Just to let you know, I really enjoyed the discussion, both on forum and on our private internal threads. We all are players, so more or less we have our own idea about what could be improved, and giving the opportunity to tell it is always appreciated.


    So, I moved the post #124 upper level. I described all the complains, frustrations and doubts that I saw here (130 posts are quite a long list, so I tried to resume what were the points), and the reasons behind that thread. I asked if it was possible to discuss and implement such small corrections to the game mechanics and - eventually - to the rules. I told that IMHO the request was very well written, and shows a really appreciable involvement of loyal and old players, and surely it deserves the attention of upper levels. I knew that an issue was related to the fact that a proposal from a single community should be approved - or should arise - from all the other communities too, but this did not represent a big trouble, IMHO.


    The answer was really clear and simple. The main problem, currently, is that Gameforge doesn't have any immediate plan to put developers at work on new features about Ikariam. It was told the same when we asked about the server merge tool, still not working, and about older game feature (Red vs Blue, Spartans, etc) that weren't enabled any more, so - more or less - is not a bolt from the blue. We don't know when this situation will change, but at least our Community has IMHO a good set of easy proposals that - as soon as new developers are available - could be resubmitted. I'm sorry I didn't give good news, but all in all, I think that this work will not be lost: you clarified what are the main complains, we can work more on them, and we are one step forward when things will change.


    Kind regards


    Sampisa

    Hello Prins,

    the topic of this thread is not the one that you are continuously trying to afford, so please open a different one if you are interested to know the opinion of other players about the Staff and related past behaviour.


    Anyway, I think that it's time to close this childish and useless discussion: thank you for your point of view. Clearly, we have a different vision of the situation. Being an adult means something else, in my opinion, e.g. attend the arranged appointment with the zoo director without leaving the discussion in scream. And after that, arguing about the zoo management without having talked with the director, makes any further criticism about the life of the animals... unreliable and useless.


    But - I repeat - this is my opinion of being adult: rules are here not to limit user's freedom, but to let the freedom of the others be respected. And - as Game Administrator - I'm sorry if you don't share it because this is exactly what I ask to - and share with - the Staff and obviously, upper levels. Yes, I stopped a lot of people who were playing unfairly (from 2010, not 2014), and rarely they admitted what they did, or they were happy for that. Were they our "best players" just because they were so active to consider legal to violate rules? No, sorry, no matter if they were spending a lot of money and playing 18 hours per day: if they had to be stopped, we stopped them, as you know. And I can live with that, because I'm glad I allowed dozen of other honest users to play in a cleaner place, even if - maybe - I was able to do it less than what I would have liked.


    So, if you want to go deeper and report your assertions about our Staff, you are free to contact our CoMa with the list of cases where we falsely accused some players; in defect, I think that false accusations are your ones. In both cases, I think that you don't need further clarification from the people on the other side of your laptop screen, but from the one in front of it.


    Kind regards

    Prins Ogidius ,

    I see a tiger in a cage that is continuously trying to find a way to exit to tear in pieces who has trapped him. I think that this is the reason that moves you, acting borderline and in a questionable way, on forum threads and PM, Discord, tickets. As we told in lot of occasion, any personal issue can't be publicly discussed (just to remind it), and telling to the world that you feel yourself victim of an injustice, due to incompetent/biased/stupid administrators or buggy/badly designed/stupid tools, no matter if it is right or not, does not change the situation, you must live with it: you are currently assisted by our CoMa, who doesn't have any of our office limits, so you can clarify everything with him.


    I want to think that you reached the age of wisdom, so please, avoid in the future any childish (borderline) behaviour that we are - at the moment - gently tolerating just because we know your situation. Obviously, if you want to add you 5 cents to the discussion on this thread, you are more than welcome. Thank you.


    Sampisa

    Thank you for your suggestions, but since you have a direct channel with CoMa, now, please move such doubts to him, since it is totally useless to discuss here about something we can't talk about.

    Kind regards

    Prins Ogidius you have already opened a ticket a week ago, that is currently at CoMa level. The discussion about our systems, how they work, how they are intended to work, and - in particular - about your situation, is currently in the hands of a Gameforge employee, who has the responsibility to tell you everything Gameforge can discuss with a player, and more, if they decide that it is possible. We - as Game or Forum staff - can't tell you nothing more than we already told you, I'm sorry.

    Kind regards

    Sampisa

    God_of_war for legal reasons, we can't ban any more 9999 as in the past, just 365. If user has paid ambrosia on his account, he can recover it in a year. In any other case, account is definitively deleted.


    Deliverance the thread will not die, don't worry.


    About the presence of banks used via BM... if I'm not wrong it is a cross-faction behaviour, widely used by both "sides". And - generally speaking - it is part of strategies from lot of alliances. So, I don't wanna put gas on fire, but I'm not totally sure that there are banks managed via VPN from a side only: yesterday - as you noticed - we stopped a lot of multis for this reason. Be sure that we don't care where banned players come from... just to be *really* clear about this matter.


    Just to let you know, we are putting more efforts on this aspect, not only on beta. And I remind that we are still looking for new GOs ;)


    Sampisa

    JFYI, the possibility to have multiaccounts was introduced at the first server merge. Lot of people had an account in both origin and destination servers, so in order to let the users continue playing both accounts, possibility of multi - along with the IP sharing option - was added to the game.


    Said that, it is really clear what is the point, thank you all for the clarifications. I admit that this is not the first time that we receive such kind of complains, about some game mechanics (e.g. the BM one) that allow "unfair" action without violating the rules, and it seems to me that - following your reasoning - in Beta this trick is widely used, or misused, as you prefer. And from the administrative side, nothing happens. About this matter, please let me remind you something.


    As GA (and this applies to TM, SGO and GO too), I'm a volunteer who has to follow some rules as stated by some GF directives. So, I just have to enforce rules as GF intends they have to be applied. It is not among my powers to change rules enforcement, so I'm here from one side as... the person to express your anger to. Obviously, this is my role and I *want* to understand what are the biggest complains, because this is my responsibility - and moral duty. From the other side, as you can see, I'm not just reading and ignoring posts (even if I could do it): that's why I put my face answering and making proposals. I would really like to help you - and this game - because, as a player and as admin, I'm sorry to see unsatisfied players, and please trust me, I don't tell it rhetorically.


    Just to be totally clear, if players don't break rules (as GF intend them), I can't make my own ones and enforce them. Anyway, I have the opportunity to move upper level your complains: I can just let your voice be listened (and it's what I will do), and be sure that I'll give my support to your proposals. But please note that I'm neither a dev, a PO, a PM, nor a person with autonomous power of decision. In this case I'm exactly as you: I can just read, try to understand the main complain and reason *with* you, not *against* you, but - as a little added value - I can report everything showing the current mood among good old players.


    That's why I asked: what is the *most* important aspect that, in your opinions, needs a definitive review? In both game mechanics (and the BM one seems to me a valid starting point for you) and in rules. Feel free to find a good answer, take your time if needed, I'll move it to the people... owning the Staff of Power.


    Best regards

    Sampisa

    Let me recap, please.

    This is a 12-years old server, obviously after so many time there are *really* strong players who built their strength thanks to a constant and continuous playing. Some of you are sure that it happened in an illegal way, in particular vs. a group of players, and I saw really angry words, I noticed frustration and great regret. Someone told that it is due to a "previous" habit on older servers (now merged). Someone told that it is due to lack of "clear and simple" rules. Someone else instead that it's because of GOs that lack on Beta and don't do their work correctly. Finally, if I'm not wrong, it seems that, in your opinions, usage of VPN is what gave to such players the opportunity to grow, managing multiple accounts (too much) in a unfair way, correct? And finally, you all think that currently on Beta the game is unplayable because of... too strong (unfair) players, correct?


    Apart what happened in the past, no matter if your opinions are correct or not (and no matter if quite nobody opened a ticket with proofs of their words - The crow in particular I'm still waiting for you lol), now there is a situation that - in your opinions - needs a Staff (or Gameforge) intervention. So, apart to be a relief valve (and I can understand that), what do you expect from this thread? I mean, what are your requests?


    If you think that current rules lack of precision, or don't consider some aspects, I would like to read a proposal with "new" (or "fixed") game rules involving the aspect that - in your opinions - ruin the game, now and in the future. I'm not joking, I'm seriously taking into consideration your opinions: I think that you all put something important among your words, that I would like to see "floating" in a organised way. Please, again, don't spread all your individual fix one-by-one in a zillion of posts, try to coordinate yourselves and prepare a "final proposal" that - I promise - I'll try to move upper level.


    Do you think that this one can be an acceptable compromise?


    Best regards


    Sampisa


    PS: any member of the "incriminated" alliance who want to intervene? ;)

    Hello,

    I wouldn't like to discuss about the "ethical" gaming, but about the "fair" one, related just to the rules that GF defined for this game. As stated in some points by some of you, personally - as a player - I agree with you, probably some different rules about the piracy (or the banks size) could help to moderate competitive and ruthless players or alliances, and to keep the game more "balanced". Other aggressive and unscrupulous behaviours, like an ally that suddenly breaks treaties and attacks ex-allied, or building incredibly big general / gold banks, are part of the game, no matter if it can be considered "ethical" or not: it's inside the rules, so we obviously don't - and can't - intervene. If you want to discuss about the rules, then we can discuss - and this could be a good starting point - but if rules (or game mechanics) don't change, also our work will not change. I remind that it happened in the past, when GF decided to reduce dramatically the rewards at the end of the piracy rounds (thank to the complains from both players and Staff).


    About the server management, we have dozen of players kept under strict control (not only on Beta, obviously). We don't stop people just because we "know for sure" that they cheat (and not necessarily gibon there is something "seriously wrong with the rules"). We too have rules, because our work must be fair and unbiased, and who is banned is violating a rule on a objective basis. That's why someone is stopped earlier, someone later, but be sure that a cheating player - sooner or later - will be stopped. And your collaboration, in some cases, is really precious for us. For the sake of clarity, the 15 accounts stopped in last days are not related the first post of this thread: you don't know what we do, but be sure that - at least on our community - we know what you do.


    Finally, we don't mind it you are a paying player or not (apart the fact that we can't know it): the fact that a player buys Ambrosia does not give to him any special right. Regarding your particular case, The crow , for privacy reason I avoid to continue this discussion, but we both know what I'm talking about; anyway, be sure that I'll be very pleased if you decide to move all your future discussions to a more "proper" level than in the past, as it seems you're doing in this thread. [+1] for you, in this case.


    Kind regards

    Good evening,

    you are always free to report the account that you consider as managed by unfair players. We *always* check all the reports, and intervene when needed. Note that we can see what a player can't check, so what you think about some players, not necessarily matches with your suspects. A report does NOT mean a ban, even if you are totally sure about your report, not necessarily it is the reality, I'm sorry: often some players are really able to claim doing this and that, or convincing other players to be so strong since they cheat... a strategy that we found in lot of server and among a lot of players. Please note, the worse ones are... quiet and silent ;)


    A couple of personal answers. The crow - as we told you "hundred of times", we DO ban when needed, not when you tell that we have to do it. You were invited "hundred of times" to open a ticket and report what you know, but you never did it: in fact, our "hundreds" or report never come from you, who instead were totally unable to provide any proof to support all your generic accusations, always written in the wrong place. This recommendation is still valid: open a ticket, and we will listen to you. If you continue to refuse to open a ticket, your ones are just empty words. So, go ahead: I'm waiting for all the missing details, if you have any. https://ikariam.support.gameforge.com/en - My whole Staff and I we really want to make a step back and stop considering you just a waste of time. But - as we already told you "hundred of times", if you don't have a name and the detail to support your words, we - again - have to consider you just a troll.


    A final note God_of_war : Iranian players are really skilled in beta, they joined years ago when ikariam.ir closed and accounts joined in Beta. It is currently a really active group, but they are players exactly like the others, and just to let you know, worse cheaters in beta were not among them. I don't like to distinguish among "iranian" or "not iranian" players: on beta, like in all the other servers, there are just "players".


    Kind regards.